Similarities between Stanford under Harbaugh and UW under Sark
by kirkd on Oct 18, 2011 10:56 PM PDT
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PrintI think most of us (with the exception of maybe Gekko) would point to Stanford's rise under Jim Harbaugh as a good model to emulate - he took a team that had gone 1-11 under Walt Harris and turned them into a 12-1 team that was widely considered the most physical team in the conference last year, with a powerful running game, a terrific pro-style QB and a strong defense. Well, the good news is there seem to be a lot of similarities between the two programs, and better yet, Washington under Sark appears to be ahead of the pace set by Harbaugh at Stanford.
Let's review first the records of both of the programs under each coach:
- Prior year: 1-11 vs. 0-12
- 1st year: 4-8 vs. 5-7
- 2nd year: 5-7 vs. 7-6
- 3rd year: 8-5 vs. 5-1 (so far)
- 4th year: 12-1 vs. ???
I'm sure all of us would be ecstatic to see Sark continuing to stay ahead of Harbaugh's pace.
Another note of interest - each coach inherited a bruiser of a RB. For Harbaugh, it was Toby Gerhart, though due to injury, he didn't get to use him much his first season, losing him to injury after 1 game. But in years 2 and 3 under Harbaugh, Gerhart was the bell-cow stud RB and the offense was based off a power running game. In Gerhart's last year, Stanford broke in a new young QB who did quite well in his first season of starting.
For Sark, he inherited a RB in Chris Polk that was somewhat of an unknown quantity - he'd had an undistinguished first season under the prior staff where he looked tentative and not at all the impossible to tackle machine he'd become. Under Sark, he's blossomed, and Sark has built a strong running game utilizing his talents. And in year 3 under Sark, a new QB has been broken in who is doing quite well (so far).
Sark's offense is looking more and more like Stanford's under Harbaugh - pro-style, lots of different formations, lots of shifts, lots of motion, built off a strong running game that sets up play-action. Sark recruited a number of highly-rated OL in his 2nd class, and those guys are forming the foundation of what could very well become the best, most physical OL in the conference in the next 2-3 years, a status currently owned by Stanford.
Also worth noting for the Holt bashers that Harbaugh brought in a new DC in his 4th season in Vic Fangio, a change that some have credited with being the final key thing to turn Stanford from a good program into a great one as their defense took a major step forward. Now, I doubt Sark will get rid of Holt, but it's another interesting comparison.
Oh, and of course another similarity - both Sark & Harbaugh are former QB's.
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Fire Holt!
“Harbaugh brought in a new DC in his 4th season in Vic Fangio, a change that some have credited with being the final key thing to turn Stanford from a good program into a great one as their defense took a major step forward.”
So if we replace Holt after the end of this season, we go 12-1 next year – I love it!
by The Dude 4 Real on Oct 19, 2011 7:50 AM PDT reply actions
why did Harbaugh bring in a new DC?
His team went 8-5 in year 4.
Formerly the fan known as Denvdawg.
"You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra
by Randall Floyd on Oct 19, 2011 8:42 AM PDT up reply actions
*correction
Year 3
Formerly the fan known as Denvdawg.
"You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra
by Randall Floyd on Oct 19, 2011 9:05 AM PDT up reply actions
There was this guy name Andrew Luck too ...
Formerly the fan known as Denvdawg.
"You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra
by Randall Floyd on Oct 19, 2011 8:45 AM PDT up reply actions
And Price is doing exactly what Luck did
Minus the good defense. All the ‘smart, in the know’ people were saying Luck was really the best QB in the conference when compared to Locker and the rest. Would love to see a good comparison of their collective trajectories in year one. Might be time to do some research..
Duck hunting season has officially begun.
Personality-wise, both guys are similar as well.
Highly competitive, energetic, charismatic. Sarkisian doesn’t have Harbaugh’s brashness, but there’s no doubt that he’s got an ego. In a good way.
So......
you don’t like Harbaugh? Or, are you referring to his “clown”? Upon more thought,and coffee….I’d suggest a “clown stomping”?
Very interesting comparisons...very well done.
I like the chances of a serious return to dominant defense that will be needed to balance out the team…especially after Mr.Polk has a new address…but, for now I just want to see some “overachieving” on the Dee !
Harbaugh needs to go Die in a Fire. Does that clarify my opinion?
by Steen on Oct 19, 2011 8:54 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I do like the mental picture.....Of a clown...
Punching him in the throat!
Aaaand I agree with Steen for once.
Nice to know we can always just bash Harbaugh.
by I'mSureI'veSeenWorse on Oct 19, 2011 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Hmmmm.......
……. maybe Sark needs to hang to Holt? As Sark is not at all an assholio, maybe dyke-head Holt serves the brashess some players want/need?
by The Dude 4 Real on Oct 19, 2011 8:54 AM PDT up reply actions
Affect isn't more important than intelect.
I’ll take the more qualified guy over the rah-rah screamer everytime.
like Monte Kiffin?
Formerly the fan known as Denvdawg.
"You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra
by Randall Floyd on Oct 19, 2011 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions
+1
It was a smart-ass post on my part, thinking that coach Dyke-Head should be kept around. Holt lost/loses me when we threw/throws his players under the bus. He is rediculously overpaid, and acts like a spoiled little girl when he throws his fits. We can get better at lower expense. Fire Holt!
by The Dude 4 Real on Oct 19, 2011 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions
Fascinating comparison – I like the trend. It looks like you’re on to something, especially the focus on building the lines.
We all want to get back to the physical play of years past, and that’s what I find attractive with Stanford’s style of play. It reminds me of the old Dawgs – good smash-mouth football on both sides of the ball. Here’s to hoping this continues.
Question for the field: I know it’s an imperfect science, but can anyone provide the ranking for each coach’s recruiting class for their first 1 – 3 years?
Rivals Rankings
Harbaugh
Year 1 (2007) – Weren’t in the top 50
Year 2 (2008) – 50th (the huskies were 14th this year by the way)
Year 3 (2009) – 20th
Year 4 (2010) – 26th
Sark
Year 1 (2009) – Weren’t in the top 50
Year 2 (2010) – 28th
Year 3 (2011) – 23rd
Year 4 (2012) – not yet complete
Formerly the fan known as Denvdawg.
"You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra
by Randall Floyd on Oct 19, 2011 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions
Scout.com Rankings
Harbaugh
year 1 – 43rd
year 2 – 48th
year 3 – 15th
year 4 – 24th
Sark
year 1 – 66th
year 2 – 11th
year 3 – 21st
Formerly the fan known as Denvdawg.
"You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra
by Randall Floyd on Oct 19, 2011 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions
Something I don't really have the time to do but ...
a breakdown by positions would be cool to see, but would definitely be overkill …
Formerly the fan known as Denvdawg.
"You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra
by Randall Floyd on Oct 19, 2011 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions
yes!
It reminds me of the old Dawgs – good smash-mouth football on both sides of the ball.
Exactly! It’s the reason why I really admire the brand of football Stanford has been playing under Harbaugh (and now Shaw) – it’s right out of the classic Don James manual. Tough, physical, strong running game, great defense, pro-style NFL prospect QB.
I love that Sark is attempting (and mostly succeeding) in reviving that tradition at the UW. If we can get the defense going that’s really the final step.
Getting our two in-state linemen to commit also
The Don didn’t let talent of that caliber, for the most part, leave the yard. I have loved Sark for putting a fence around the state, but this years recruiting class will be a big test. If we want to build our lines, we can’t have a class like last year. He can recruit the skill positions, now he needs to recruit the lines consistently.
Duck hunting season has officially begun.
Who did he lose out on?
I was under the impression that he was 5-for-5 on all of the WA blue chip prospects last year, and that there weren’t any blue chip O-linemen in the WA class.
by Carl Shinyama on Oct 19, 2011 7:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Sark vs. Harbaugh
Great write up, as always you bring some great stuff to the table.
Question for those in the know: Did Harbaugh fire the previous DC’s (they actually list co defensive coordinators), did they leave on their own, or some other scenario?
I absolutely love Sark as a head coach, he seems to have all the necessary tools. He’s quite good with the media, great offensive mind, great recruiter, very good motivator, seems to have very good ideals and tends to be a wise individual (turn down an unstable NFL job).
I really only have one question remaining about Sark as a head coach: Can he fire an under performing coach? No, I’m not referring just to Holt. If a position coach (or coordinator) isn’t getting the job done, isn’t a good enough teacher, or maybe not a good enough recruiter, does Sark have it in him to cut a guy (possibly a friend) loose for the good of the program?
"Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing."
"Legends are made on the shores of Lake Washington"
I'm hoping things don't get to that just yet
This coaching staff is really close and everyone seems to be on the same page. I know their have been some questions pertaining to the defense, but it’s really coming around. As of now, I don’t see any real sign of making a coaching change. 5-1 overall and 3-0 in league speaks volumes!
All I saw was purple
Are you positive the defense is "coming around"?
That’s what we all thought last year too!
"Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing."
"Legends are made on the shores of Lake Washington"
? they did come around pretty well last year culminating in a pretty dominating Holiday Bowl
Damn, my eyeball tastes good.
@chrislandon
True
They did perform much better as the season went on, but the opposing offenses got much less talented as the season progressed. This season the competition is more spread out, which will give us a better picture of where the defense it at.
"Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing."
"Legends are made on the shores of Lake Washington"
I like Harbough the coach, not Harbough the idiot
He crosses a fine line in what is deemed acceptable behavior. Their has been instances where he has ran up the score just to give the opposing coach the business. His latest post game rant just about got him punched in the eye socket. I think it’s great when coaches act like players following a victory. Just do it in the lockerroom after you have respectully shaken the opposing coaches hand.
All I saw was purple
Harbaugh
Not sure what I think about the guy. But you are right, as a coach he seems to get the job done very well.
"Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing."
"Legends are made on the shores of Lake Washington"
You should learn how to spell his name.
UW Dawg Pound - SBN Seattle
by John Berkowitz on Oct 19, 2011 8:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Great write up Kirk
Agree with all your points on the similarities of these two programs. Stanford is definitely a program worth imitating at the moment that is no doubt, I think the fact that we have come further faster with young talent speaks volumes to the coaching staff. I am one of those guys who chants fire Holt at every big play the D gives up but after the game, when I’ve had a chance to cool off and think about it, WE ARE STILL VERY YOUNG and it’s tuff to remember that in the heat of the battle. I think the problem for Holt is this town has seen its share of dominating defenses and we are hungry for that to return more than anything, and in this time of the spread offense and seemingly every QB in the PAC able to go pro at the end of the year every D is giving up points. This week will be a test of epic proportions for our D and I will be a nervous wreck trying to avoid anxiety attacks entering the 3rd qtr, here’s hoping both myself and the D survive Saturday!
Last PAC-12 Rose Bowl winner not named USC....Washington
Some interesting stuff from Ted Miller too
“Stanford ranks third in the Pac-12 in rushing offense (181.7 yards per game). Washington ranks fourth (173.7 ypg). Stanford ranks first — and second in the nation — in run defense (59.5 ypg). Washington ranks third — 17th in the nation — (97 ypg).
“Of course, being physical doesn’t mean you don’t throw the ball; these teams have combined for 40 touchdown passes — it just means balance creates efficiency: Stanford is No. 1 and Washington No. 2 in the conference in passing efficiency. "
He also called to attention that Stanford owes a lot of its success to David DeCastro, a Washington-born lineman. Who are UW’s most important recruits this year? Two Washington-born linemen.
Wow
losing DeCastro sucked
When what is arguably the state’s top high-school football program, and certainly the Seattle-area’s top football program produces two high-level OL in the span of a few years (Steve Schilling, David DeCastro) and the Huskies land neither one – that’s a major blow.
There’s a lot riding on Sark being able to sign Garnett & Banner (and Brostek too) on top of Dean, and hopefully at least one more on top of that (English? Eldrenkamp? Someone else from Hawai’i or California?)
Losing Garnett to Stanford would doubly-hurt.
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